RE: Toonstruck 2 will officially come out... If fans act now! - 2

According to Arem, Toonstruck 2 is mostly finished, except programming. So I think the "financial monster" won't be able to spoil it.

Zitat von Cyrus

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According to Arem, Toonstruck 2 is mostly finished, except programming. So I think the "financial monster" won't be able to spoil it.

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If they want to make a state-of-the-art game out of it, there are countless ways to spoil it.

Now I get why you hate multiposting so much, it's a real pain in the rear to post different answers on two topics at a time. I can only blame myself here ^^

Zitat

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Why do you think we arent good representatives?

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I was only referring to the quarrel I had with neomix21 and Nouty, not to your project itself. If a potential publisher had a look at our past conversation, he would snort in derision. Thankfully, it's all over now.

Zitat

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just one short question: dont you get it?
i mean do you really think that the developers (who earn their money with developing games) would give a damn on the talents, the potential and of course the ideas we have? Like you already said, the only thing we could do is making the project public and thats, in my opinion, something that doesnt need any talent (except for writing abilities of course).
So i really would love to see Toonstruck 2 like it was meant to be, i REALLY do. but everything i hear when the developers speak about it is: financial, money, investors,... i mean come on, even you have to admit that this shows the real reason why they want to make a sequel.

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To be honest, I get it... and I don't get it. I see that you hate the financial dimension of the video game industry, but I don't understand why. I have to admit, I'm a little confused.
Since you're a supporter of open source development, I don't get why the collaboration between non-profit organizations and traditional developers/publishers appears impossible to you, or even... Evil? I insist, but you should really check the "Arsenal of Democracy" development story, it proves this kind of mixed development is possible, although not very frequent.
I'm not saying I'm 100% sure you will be asked for help by the developers themselves, but it is a possibility one would be unwise to neglect. Of course, if you reject every game studio because money is involved at one point or another, nothing will happen between the developers and you. Ever heard of self-fulfilling prophecies?

Zitat

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So to cut it short: i can understand why you feel attacked and i want to apologize to you, thats just not the way i want to welcome somebody in this forum.
and realting the point you support: i really support toonstruck but not the financial monster machinery which would stand behind it.

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Thank you unterbuchse, that's nice of you, I really appreciate. I must apologize to all of you as well, for my multiposting was stupid and to some extent, rude, and mainly because I lost my temper way too fast. Still, I don't regret my coming here, because I didn't expect to have such a conversation with you in the end... And I like to be surprised.

Now on to your second message.

Bernard

PS:

Zitat

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If they want to make a state-of-the-art game out of it, there are countless ways to spoil it.

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As I said on posting.php?mode=reply&f=29&t=251 (damn you, multiposting!), I have a totally different interpretation of what Keith wrote. What Keith said is that in order "to bring the game up to today’s standards", the team would have "to restore many of the original assets, rebuild much of the original code, and re-incorporate the materials into the project." Toonstruck's story, characters, environments, riddles and jokes are timeless, this is why the game was an instant classic. What aged bad however is the video part, however. Remember what was the native resolution of the game, 640*480 maybe? Or the scan-line compressed FMV? Put away your nostalgia lenses and you'll see how it is outdated.
If you want an example, try the recent remakes of the first and second Monkey Island games and switch between classic mode and hi-res look, the difference is obvious. Another example: Blade Runner is a wonderful sci-fi adventure game but nowadays its voxel pixellated characters look like crap: this doesn't mean by re-releasing it developers would feel the urge to alter its gameplay or storytelling.
A new edition of Toonstruck wouldn't betray any of the original's gameplay features, as Keith hinted to today’s graphic standards. Altering TS's gameplay wouldn't make any sense (adventure games' mechanics are archaic and this is why we like them) and it would be way too expensive and time-consuming anyway.

Imagine you'd be a developer with enough money to complete your game.

Would ever even consider to let somebody participate in your project
who you never met in real life ?

Probably not.

You're absolutely right => get back to work, you lazy nerds

What I don't understand at all is why radical_dreamer and me are the only ones here that seem to want to play the REAL Toonstruck 2 instead of the fake one we're making.

If that's truly the case, then believe me, I will leave the project and lend my support and talents to Keith Arem instead.

Zitat von tymime

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What I don't understand at all is why radical_dreamer and me are the only ones here that seem to want to play the REAL Toonstruck 2 instead of the fake one we're making. If that's truly the case, then believe me, I will leave the project and lend my support and talents to Keith Arem instead.

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Why so radical, Mr. Tymime?
I see your point, but I don't see why you can't understand what we're driving at?
Mr. Arem does not want our talents. He just needs our financial support to get a project started to get him more money.

That's what I think.

Keith Arem + money = Toonstruck 2 finally released

[quote="tymime":1v9mt[album]7[/album]]Keith Arem + money = Toonstruck 2 finally released[/quote:1v9mt[album]7[/album]]

Nice expression, but what if your "original TS2" doesn't get the love it needs during development?

Do you think they will keep it 100% as it was before realease of TS1 ?
They probably won't, because they'd get much more money if they make a mainstream game out of it,
to target a bigger group of customers.

Do you think anybody in the world would not exploit the
financial potential of this game, if he already had half of the game finished ?

I think I speak for us all when I say that we want TS2.
But we don't want it to be raped by some cash-hungry wannabe businessmen...

@neomix: think Broken Sword Director's cut. It wasn't spoiled by money, and they kept the original atmosphere. Besides, how can you turn a classic adventure into a mainstream game? Boss battles with Nefarious and Fluffy in 3D?

neomix, unterbuchse- clearly you have no faith in Keith Arem as an artist or a human being. It's obvious that you doubt his ability and willingness to release a good product, and that he is not accepting the talents of artists who like the original game, unlike what I felt was implied in Arem's messages- and that it is foolish of me and radical_dreamer to think otherwise. If I knew for a fact that Keith Arem has become the George Lucas of video games, I wouldn't doubt you, but no one here has really proven that- there has only been a general mistrust of anyone intending to make a living by making some sort of profit.

It is this sort of disheartening, untrusting, negative attitude that makes me doubt the abilities of either of you to make this game have the fun, tongue-in-cheek spirit of the original, quite frankly. Toonstruck is a game that shines with the youthful, ambitious, and ever-hopeful spirit of young artists trying to prove themselves and break into "show biz". The exceedingly anti-authoritarian and- more importantly- bitter worldview you've been showing is not an environment for making what is ultimately a positive work of art, and suggests a personality of a much older person who has given up on humanity. Worse, it's divisive. This is not the sort of leadership I can accept when contributing to an art project.

You probably think I'm hopelessly unrealistic, but believe me when I say that I've managed to remain optimistic despite any disappointments. I despise corporate tampering, greed, and tastelessness as well, and look upon any unfamiliar person in a position of authority with skeptism and suspicion, but I interpret Keith's words as an opportunity- not an omen! Perhaps if radical_dreamer (an apt username, I must say) could ask Keith to clarify what he means by "support", we could clear up this whole mess.

To prove my point, I'm still hoping that things can become more positive around here, despite the amibiguity of these e-mails and some of the disputes over it.